Thread:CSaPForumWall ~ VS Threads/@comment-31835132-20180517203410/@comment-32286613-20180610093318

Zenkaibattery1 wrote: "Really, just wanted to say, Nagisa stomps, no matter what. :/ First of, ok, she isn't 5D in this battle, but she is protected by Goddess Madoka, who is."

Demigra isn't 5-D in this battle, but his magic is. Your point? Demigra stomps hard

"Demigra's magic might let him have Mid-Godly Regen (since he can regenerate from being erased from existence), but Nagisa can bypass it, due to her Non-Existence ability."

Ok? He can bypass Regen up to mid-godly as well

"In order to resist that erasure, you shold have High-Godly Regen. So, Demigra's Magic here is entirely useless"

That's IF she can use it on Demigra in time. She won't do it straight away whereas Demigra's first move is mind hax. Furthermore, you're ignoring the propeties of his Magic. Even if he's gone, his magic will still exist. Let's assume he's gone never to be seen again, his Magic will still be a higher dimensional figure for her to face, which she cannot defeat.

"And sure, it MIGHT be able to surpass resistances and immunities, but that is irrelevant considering Nagisa's hax. Right the moment Demigra is preparing one of his OP magica attacks, he's already death because of either Non-Existence or Law Manipu or many other things."

It does bypass. It isn't irrelevant and there's nothing she can do against his magc. Furthermore, Demigra, or Demigra's Magic doesn't depend on Demigra using it. His Magic is passively multiversal and is a presence everywhere, so he doesn't need to instiage it. The battle starts, his magic sets off on it's own, and she's done. Demigra has linked non-existence with existence and he has law manipulation as well. That's not special

"List of Nagisas's hax"

Ok? No point in mentioning them if you won't say why they help

"Since Demigra is not a trascendental being in this battle, as he's only 2-A, he'll be affected by that massive Conceptual Manipulation. I mean, the Law of Cycles can basically rewrite all the concepts on a Multiversal+ scale regardless of how stupid or absolute the concepts are. Sounds pretty OP."

She herself is also only a 2-A being, honestly the madoka shit is outiside help. Ok? Demigra's Magic is High Multiversal+ and has all the hax he can utilize.

"So, why Nagisa stomps: 1) Even if Demigra is 5D, she is protected by a 5D being anyway. 2) Demigra can't regenerate from Nagisa's Non-Existence. 3) Nothing stops Nagisa from overpowering completely Demigra's Magic with her hax. 4) Even if Demigra's Magic can bypass resistances and immunities, Nagisa has enough abilities to counter that, and also, i'd like to know why Demigra's Magic can bypass resistances..."

1) That doesn't matter. Demigra's Magic is 5-D, will bypass her immunity and resistance to mind manipulation and take her over. You're strawmanning this point" 2) Demigra can do the same thing. 3) Same goes with Demigra's magic. The only straw Nagisa is pulling on is her powers from Madoka, she herself is useless in this battle. 4) Prove to me she can bypass High Multiversal+ ranged passive Magic.

Why can it bypass?

Gods are immune to Demon God abilities

The Time Breaker masks, which were made through the Magic and evil energy, has shown to bypass beings with God-Ki and take them over. We can't use 5D Magic for Demigra. If yes, then i could perfectly use 5D Nagisa's Law Manipulation.

At this point, your points are basically "5D scale". It's not how it works. Just because his magic is 5D, '''it doesn't mean that it can works on someone who has resistance to it. "5D Magic" isn't a scale, you just proved that his magic is 5th Dimensional potentially, but that is power. The same goes for Mind Hax: there's no such thing like "it can affects 4D beings".

There are 3D beings who can resist mind hax from a 4D being. Just because a character is 4D, it doesn't mean its mind hax is: mind hax (and in this case, Magic as well) doesn't have a scale, it's not lke it can affect  4D structures or such.

Just because a character has 5D Magic, it doesn't mean it has to affect lower beings. The info of 5D Magic is that the latter tracended reality and reached a 5D plane of existence. But that is completely useless. Just because it is potentially 5D doesn't mean lower beings must be affected by it. Even if Demigra's magic might have affected 5D beings, it doesn't change the fact that that is from a physical point of view, however lower beings that have resistance to that CAN resist magic.

And if it isn't from a physical point of view, then you are just debunking yourself: if Demigra's magic is what allowed him to mind hax 5D being, it doesn't mean it also must affect lower beings. Mind hax doesn't have a scale. It's not like reality warping which has a scale in power and use. Mind hax is simply the ability to control other people's minds. Lower beings with a resistance to it can resist mind hax.'''

'''Point is, Mind Hax is useless. Nagisa can resist it, so nothing stops her from erasing him.'''

And no dear, Nagisa's law is still 5D, regardless of what you think. So it can counter and overpower Demigra's hax. The Law of Cycles, as the manifestation of Madoka's law, allows the others to nullificate powers, such as when it nullificated Ult. Gretchen's impurity hax.

A 5D Law that allows her to change all the concepts in the multiverse (and like i said, Demigra himself in this battle isn't 5D, so he'll get affected by that): by doing that, Nagisa could just change the multiverse so that the race of Demigra never existed or things that will conceptually deny Demigra.

And no again. The Law of Cycles isn't outside help. As a Law of Cycle assistant, Nagisa can fully manipulate it. Point and case.

Demigra's magic being omnipresent is useless as well. Because it might be everywhere, but it doesn't change the fact that Demigra has to use it to destroy Nagisa. And once again, Nagisa's law can just completely erase Demigra and his reality with the blink of an eye, since the Law of Cycles is also omnipreset as it exists everywhere in the multiverse and even the non-existant multiverse of Witches.

The difference is, unlike Demigra's Magic, the Law of Cycles shows its powers even when not used by Nagisa. After all, it is the same law that defines the multiverse and manipulate the balance of the entropy of the multiverse, and because of that it is constanly activated and '''it constantly erases witches in the non-existent World of Witches. '''

Which means that it can also erase Demigra instantly, and mind you, Demigra hasn't High-Godly regen.

And about the Magic point always existing, you are missing the biggest point dear: 1) Nagisa is 5D via the Law of Cycles. Law of Cycles > Demigra's Magic for reasons stated above.

Being protected by Godoka also isn't outside help at all, since it's more like a contract rather than an actual protection. Every soul of Magical Girls that lost their hope trascend the multiverse and reach Heaven, here, they find the Law of Cycles Assistant, which help Godoka in all her jobs and helps her when something is wrong (such as for example, in the Rebellion Movie).

Crystallized Magical Girls, as Sayaka stated, have to keep the memories of the reset and of Madoka, '''that is their job. They are loyal to Godoka, and their Crystallized self is always in contact with their true Law of Cycle's assistant version, which has a contract of sort with Godoka.'''

Overall, Godoka's magic is like,protecting them always, or something like that. It is a bit vague, but we can say for sure that it's not 100% outside help.

Overall: 1) Demigra's Magic is still useless. 2) Difference is Nagisa can regenerate from that. Godoka and the Law of Cycles disappeared in Rebellion, along with their perfect heaven.. However, Madoka and her law were still there. What does that mean? High-Godly regen Godoka and Law of Cycles. Law of Cycle Nagisa is a concept of the Law of Cycle.

Not to mention that Sayaka (Crystallized) still kept her memories of Madoka, and her true self still survived the change of the concepts of the multiverse.

High-Godly Regen Nagisa and Law of Cycle. Nice!! Meaning that Demigra is still a huge weakling, he can't even erase Nagisa, but Nagisa can...

3) You are heavily downplaying Nagisa. SHE CAN USE THE LAW OF CYCLE goddamit. It's not an ability Godoka granted her. 4) Just proved above.

Nagisa still stomps. Now i need a break from my laptop. Later.